Panicked pilots too often forget to switch off their electrics prior to impact. I've heard of pilots that walked away from crashes drenched in fuel, but otherwise unscathed because they remembered to kill the aircraft's electrics. Broken leads to trim lights, fuel sensors and anticollision lights are significant sources of fuel ignition if they remain live during a crash landing.
MAYDAY, not priority landing SPEAK CLEARLY, you're talking through a radio full of static FLY THE PLANE, exhaust gas temperatures don't have priority over your life, blow up the engine if it gives you necessary altitude LAND THE PLANE, if you are engine out, you should not be target fixating on the airport, put the plane on the ground
Not sure how they teach in the states, but here it's taught when you are on the climb out and you lose power. Go for a road a field anything. Just don't try to make the airport as you won't make it and your altitude is at a premium.
Another good example of poor ATC and FAA standards on terminology. 3 times for "priority landing" before the controller got it?! ICAO the process and call mayday – even US controllers can't fvck that up, although they will still insist on asking you pointless crap and distracting you.
This business is getting way out of hand. All it seems to be doing is wasting fuel to forsake the environment.! This is not sustainable moving forward.?
A few comments here are out of line. But I don't think discussing ways to prevent such tragic outcomes in the future is out of line. This will end up as a teaching lesson, I'm sure. Remember in theatre fires most people flee towards the exit they came from not processing the other options. Overcoming the "tunnel vision" that happens in crisis is something that everyone should work on. Look at how Sully calmly but quickly went through all options and decided that the river was the best chance for survival. That is an uncommon skill.
Every pilot needs to practice saying the magic words “Mayday mayday mayday”. It’s clear, and it focuses everyone on one and only one task: getting you safely on the ground. Say it clearly and slowly, say what you’re going to do, and then get off the radio and do it.
Wishing comfort to this pilot’s family in this terrible moment.
My deepest condolences to the family and friends of the two people lost. That pilot sounded calm as a cucumber right until that last call. My heart also goes out to the controller – you could hear the pain in his voice in his first call right after: "Cherokee 93X, extend downwind." I hope someone relieved him soon, and that he's getting lots of support both personally and professionally. Fly safe, everyone.
ABSOUTE Rule # 1 : ENGINE TROUBLE, Set up a glide (maximum performance) Look for a place to land , and Head for it ! AIRSPEED, AIRSPEED, AIRSPEED ! ! ! Don't quit flying before the airplane does ! Fullerton CA 1968 night time, right seat . Please, anyone with wings, Learn this and practice it ! Bob Hoover lived by it .
The golf course was right in front of him. You have to be hardwired for loss of power on takeoff, even more so in an urban terrain. This has to be the primary thought during every climb out – push hard, I'm going THERE. It's done, The decision has already been made.
This remains your primary thought until reaching a safe altitude. At my home airport, at 0 to 800 feet I'm going just to the left (sloping side of a hill, not a great option), from 400 to 600 (wind dependent) I'm going for the lake off to my left and try to land near shore, above 800 possible return to runway since all other options are not great and I have practiced this.
The idea of a return to runway from 200 feet agl (according to adsb data/airport elevation) in any airplane is never going to work. He sealed their fate when he chose to make the left hand turn. I feel bad for the passenger.
I am the pilot flying N737PM. I witnessed everything happen after my go around. When I re-entered downwind, I heard the scream over the radio. I quickly looked over and saw the plane go down and explode. I immediately felt sick to my stomach. The thought of this is still bothering me today. RIP.
Sad! Looks to me, according to adsbexchange track that he tried to stretch too far to land on 16L and perhaps accelerated stall during turn. Seems like 34R was obtainable. Monday morning ya know. Perhaps unfamiliar stall speeds/characteristics for CFI. This was not your usual 172. Rip.
This is why simulated engine failure/off airport landings are so important. There's a horrifying number of crashes that have happened when an engine failure turned into a stall/spin or otherwise loss of control. You HAVE to know best glide speed and get to it asap. You cannot pull up, or otherwise extend the range of your aircraft. It is not possible. If you are departing a runway and climbing out, the airport is not an option. Just look up the "impossible turn." DO NOT do a u-turn. Statistically, it will lead to your death. Your best bet is to scan the forward 180° of your field of view (preferably with the least amount of maneuvering required) and go for it. Forget saving the airplane. That's what insurance is for. You are better off landing on the middle of a busy Boulevard and ripping the rings off with buses than whatever this was. You'll at least have a chance.
This loss of life is extremely tragic and my condolences to the family, friends and colleagues of these two people. I am a pilot of the Czech Cruiser, originally Piper Sport (CRUZ). I will not make any comment, or speculate, about the accident directly, other to say that ATC has distinguished the profession once again. My only comment is about the aircraft and that it is equipped with a ballistic parachute. The only warning in the POH is, do not extend the parachute above 120 knots. The deployment is 2 steps, remove the pin and twist the handle.
As a non-pilot.. I often wonder if "touch and go's" are a good idea? You spend so much time checking your aircraft before taking off.. but then you just power right through another take-off without checking anything… would this pilot still be alive if he landed, ran a checklist and then took off again? Perhaps not feasible or this wouldn't have been something that would have been checked with a landing and checklist?
I've done some flying out of KVNY and have always been quite concerned for this exact scenario, especially because there is absolutely no open place to land near by the airport other than maybe the 405 freeway just east of the airport. My condolences go to this person and his family.
48 Comments
If only they had kept their speed . There was a lot of clear space to land on even if it wasn’t a runway ….
He made the problem bigger than it looks so as the result. 👎 Absence of good decisions lead to bad outcomes. Basic!
Panicked pilots too often forget to switch off their electrics prior to impact. I've heard of pilots that walked away from crashes drenched in fuel, but otherwise unscathed because they remembered to kill the aircraft's electrics. Broken leads to trim lights, fuel sensors and anticollision lights are significant sources of fuel ignition if they remain live during a crash landing.
Learn from their mistakes.
MAYDAY, not priority landing
SPEAK CLEARLY, you're talking through a radio full of static
FLY THE PLANE, exhaust gas temperatures don't have priority over your life, blow up the engine if it gives you necessary altitude
LAND THE PLANE, if you are engine out, you should not be target fixating on the airport, put the plane on the ground
Oh God, it was just yesterday! Condolences to the loved ones of the student and instructor who were killed. How tragic!
Never extend the glide. Airspeed airspeed airspeed.
RIP
Not sure how they teach in the states, but here it's taught when you are on the climb out and you lose power. Go for a road a field anything. Just don't try to make the airport as you won't make it and your altitude is at a premium.
Oh, that last transmission…so sad. RIP.
Another good example of poor ATC and FAA standards on terminology. 3 times for "priority landing" before the controller got it?! ICAO the process and call mayday – even US controllers can't fvck that up, although they will still insist on asking you pointless crap and distracting you.
Sad☹
This business is getting way out of hand. All it seems to be doing is wasting fuel to forsake the environment.! This is not sustainable moving forward.?
Damn. This hits hard, as I personally live really close to Van Nuys airport. RIP.
that sucks
I feel like some troll reddit group decided to invade this comment section… smh. RIP and condolences to friends/family.
A few comments here are out of line. But I don't think discussing ways to prevent such tragic outcomes in the future is out of line. This will end up as a teaching lesson, I'm sure. Remember in theatre fires most people flee towards the exit they came from not processing the other options. Overcoming the "tunnel vision" that happens in crisis is something that everyone should work on. Look at how Sully calmly but quickly went through all options and decided that the river was the best chance for survival. That is an uncommon skill.
So very tragic. My condolences to all 💔
Really shitty xenophobic comments here
Surely they could have made it down by performing an impossible turn.
Damn he could have landed on the golf course straight ahead.
KVNY is always an exceptionally professional operation. Condolences to all involved.
Every pilot needs to practice saying the magic words “Mayday mayday mayday”. It’s clear, and it focuses everyone on one and only one task: getting you safely on the ground. Say it clearly and slowly, say what you’re going to do, and then get off the radio and do it.
Wishing comfort to this pilot’s family in this terrible moment.
The CFI who lost his life along with the student pilot was my known family friend. My deepest condolences to both of them.
So unfortunate 😢. As Dan Gryder would say: point the nose of the aircraft down and save your life.
RIP RONAK YOU WILL ALWAYS BE REMEMBERED 🙏🏻🪽
What a shame. That controller was awesome though.
My deepest condolences to the family and friends of the two people lost. That pilot sounded calm as a cucumber right until that last call. My heart also goes out to the controller – you could hear the pain in his voice in his first call right after: "Cherokee 93X, extend downwind." I hope someone relieved him soon, and that he's getting lots of support both personally and professionally. Fly safe, everyone.
As someone who trained out of VNY, flying in and out of there countless times, it's chilling to see this. May the pilot and passenger rest in peace.
What the heck was that last mic keying.
Hearing his last comm made my stomach drop so fast…..
ABSOUTE Rule # 1 : ENGINE TROUBLE, Set up a glide (maximum performance) Look for a place to land , and Head for it ! AIRSPEED, AIRSPEED, AIRSPEED ! ! ! Don't quit flying before the airplane does ! Fullerton CA 1968 night time, right seat . Please, anyone with wings, Learn this and practice it ! Bob Hoover lived by it .
The golf course was right in front of him. You have to be hardwired for loss of power on takeoff, even more so in an urban terrain. This has to be the primary thought during every climb out – push hard, I'm going THERE. It's done, The decision has already been made.
This remains your primary thought until reaching a safe altitude. At my home airport, at 0 to 800 feet I'm going just to the left (sloping side of a hill, not a great option), from 400 to 600 (wind dependent) I'm going for the lake off to my left and try to land near shore, above 800 possible return to runway since all other options are not great and I have practiced this.
The idea of a return to runway from 200 feet agl (according to adsb data/airport elevation) in any airplane is never going to work. He sealed their fate when he chose to make the left hand turn. I feel bad for the passenger.
I am the pilot flying N737PM. I witnessed everything happen after my go around. When I re-entered downwind, I heard the scream over the radio. I quickly looked over and saw the plane go down and explode. I immediately felt sick to my stomach. The thought of this is still bothering me today. RIP.
Sad! Looks to me, according to adsbexchange track that he tried to stretch too far to land on 16L and perhaps accelerated stall during turn. Seems like 34R was obtainable. Monday morning ya know. Perhaps unfamiliar stall speeds/characteristics for CFI. This was not your usual 172. Rip.
It seems from the path here that he had almost made it. Puzzling.
This is why simulated engine failure/off airport landings are so important. There's a horrifying number of crashes that have happened when an engine failure turned into a stall/spin or otherwise loss of control. You HAVE to know best glide speed and get to it asap. You cannot pull up, or otherwise extend the range of your aircraft. It is not possible. If you are departing a runway and climbing out, the airport is not an option. Just look up the "impossible turn." DO NOT do a u-turn. Statistically, it will lead to your death. Your best bet is to scan the forward 180° of your field of view (preferably with the least amount of maneuvering required) and go for it. Forget saving the airplane. That's what insurance is for. You are better off landing on the middle of a busy Boulevard and ripping the rings off with buses than whatever this was. You'll at least have a chance.
RIP.
RIP ROBERT SPENCER THE BEST MAN I KNEW
This loss of life is extremely tragic and my condolences to the family, friends and colleagues of these two people. I am a pilot of the Czech Cruiser, originally Piper Sport (CRUZ). I will not make any comment, or speculate, about the accident directly, other to say that ATC has distinguished the profession once again. My only comment is about the aircraft and that it is equipped with a ballistic parachute. The only warning in the POH is, do not extend the parachute above 120 knots. The deployment is 2 steps, remove the pin and twist the handle.
Oh Ronak!! Buddy i miss you! Im so sorry this happened!!! Rest in Peace my best bud!
As a non-pilot.. I often wonder if "touch and go's" are a good idea? You spend so much time checking your aircraft before taking off.. but then you just power right through another take-off without checking anything… would this pilot still be alive if he landed, ran a checklist and then took off again? Perhaps not feasible or this wouldn't have been something that would have been checked with a landing and checklist?
Oh man, you can hear the pain in that poor controllers voice…awful situation.
Senseless.
I've done some flying out of KVNY and have always been quite concerned for this exact scenario, especially because there is absolutely no open place to land near by the airport other than maybe the 405 freeway just east of the airport. My condolences go to this person and his family.
Is it worth the risks involved?? Of coarse not ever!!!!
Always remember that it is better to damage a fairway and a plane, than to land in a fatal manner
Why turn with no power?? Total insanity. Controller gave no advice…
Too bad he didn’t opt to land downwind. Seems like he could’ve made it.
The scream as he dies – that’s literally chilling